What is a Concrete Countertop Mix: Crafting with Hardware Store Finds
Welcome, fellow concrete aficionados, to yet another tantalizing episode of The Concrete Podcast! Just when you thought we'd exhausted every topic, we unearth fresh revelations in the world of concrete. This week, we explore the use of dual blade handheld mixers with AR Glass Fiber Mixes. But hold onto your hats, because we're about to dig deep into the essence of the matter: What exactly defines a Concrete Countertop Mix? Join us as we dissect the art of modifying hardware store finds to create a concrete countertop mix. And to spice things up, we'll cap it off with a head-to-head price comparison between Buddy Rhodes ECC mix and Kodiak Pro Maker Mix. So, fellow seekers of concrete wisdom, grab your ear pods and join us for this discussion!
TRANSCRIPT:
0:15
All right.
Let's do this again.
Let's start this again.
OK, go ahead.
Hello, Jon Schuler.
Hello, Brandon Gore.
How's it going?
Good man.
Good.
Good.
Good to hear.
0:31
I've told the story before about how I used a dual blade mixer and I mixed up concrete in a class in a workshop.
It's the first time I reused the Collomix XO6.
No what?
Is it, an XO6?
It's the 50. 5.
Yeah, the 55.
It's the first time I reused it before, at the time they came from Germany.
0:49
They weren't even sold in the US yet, and I use it in a class and the piece completely just fell apart under its own weight because we shredded the fibers and it had to do with the dual blade mixer.
It has like a scissoring action and it just shredded the glass fibers, right?
And that one experience was all it took.
1:07
It's, you know, first time, shame on me second time, you know, or whatever it is, I don't know who knows where that saying goes, but how's that saying go, Jon, now That very.
I think the first name's a shame on you.
In other words, you did something bad to me, but if I let you do it a second time, then it's shame on me.
1:24
Exactly.
Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me.
You know, in that case it was it was They didn't tell me and I didn't know.
And unfortunately I used that mixer in front of a workshop of paying attendees for the first time, which is a completely idiotic thing to do.
1:41
Never use new piece of equipment in a class for the first time unless you want things to go sideways and you look like an idiot.
So.
Well, true.
But you look how much you've learned.
Well, everybody, look.
How much you've learned.
From that experience.
I know, but what it taught me was I'll never do that again.
1:57
And so I never did.
I never did.
But you posted a question on our concrete tile.
What, what?
What is that forum on Facebook?
We have a really great.
Countertops and tiles?
Something like that, Yeah.
Let.
Me.
Pull it up just so I can tell people that are listening, you want to join our group on Facebook.
2:13
It's concrete countertops, concrete sinks, concrete furniture, and concrete tile.
It's a private group to 2.5000 members.
If you go on Facebook and look that up, you'll find it.
If you like brutalist stuff at all, that's where I post a lot of the really cool brutalist stuff that I find, which really isn't tile and stuff, but it's still awesome.
2:33
So but anyways, you asked the question about using a dual blade mixer.
Any tips and tricks?
And all these people chimed in they're like dude, I use I use a dual blade with GFRC and it works great and you know I don't have any problems with fibers blah blah blah.
And what that says to me is I made a just 100% just I'm never going to do that again decision because I got burned.
2:57
But other people having good success.
So my experience and other people's experience can be completely different, right?
And I'm not necessarily right on anything.
I'm probably not right on anything.
I'm probably wrong about everything.
So I guess what I'm saying is it's so I I I'm OK with being wrong.
3:13
I'm OK with hearing other people's success where I didn't have success.
And saying you know because it doesn't work for me doesn't mean it won't work for you because there's obviously plenty of people that are using a dual blade mixer and and having good success.
Far more than I thought too.
I was surprised how many people chimed in and was like, you know, once you go double blade you'll never go back.
3:32
Oh, don't let your daughter use that double blade mixer.
What I what I back to what I was saying.
I mean, there's so much more or you know, let's just say all of us are so much further down the road than where you were then.
3:48
I mean meaning again like the things we talk about now, I'm guessing you were not using the Owens Corning fibers at that time, which the Owens Corning fibers, the half inch and the 3/4 inch, I mean they are a totally different fiber than all the Nippon stuff that we used to use.
4:09
Well, back then it was, it was Saint Gabon fibers, yeah.
Which then went, but I mean they were a softer fiber.
They were more pliable.
So versus the almost, you know, mini toothpick like that of the Owens Corning that can definitely handle more shear.
4:25
That doesn't mean you want to beat the crap out of him, but they can definitely handle it much better than than the other fibers.
So, so that I guess what I'm saying that would be #1 you may have gotten away with it then had you been using the other glass fibers.
4:41
No, no, we still because we mixed that mix for so long.
There was, I don't know how many people in a class.
I'm just going off memory, but I feel like it was like 10 to maybe 15 people in the class and every person mixed, they all took turns and they're like take my picture, man, you know, take a video, man.
5:00
They're just going full blast.
I mean that that makes probably got mixed a solid 20 to 25 minutes.
Oh yeah.
It doesn't matter.
It got destroyed.
Destroyed.
Yeah.
So, you know, it was just one of those things, but well, but.
I so along that line just because we're on double padded mixers, but there are still some.
5:21
I'm excited.
I'm excited.
It was back at the hoedown at Dusty's where talking to Sir Ho and you know, BB and in anyway, a whole group of people were just and Dusty himself, who has his double powder mixer there.
Right.
5:37
And I'm just like, oh man, of course.
And W Dusty would always bring him to Pinnacles too, bring his mixer.
And I'm like, OK, so I went ahead and ponied up and I bought one.
Now what was what was that last August?
Something like that.
September.
I don't even remember.
5:53
But anyway, what I'm saying is it came in, but I still had my XO six.
It's working just fine.
So I just basically like, yeah, it's here, it's here.
And I didn't use it at all.
But I have to admit, man, that doing the XO 6, whatever happened to it?
6:09
I think you were saying maybe the trigger just went or the just went out on it or something.
So I'm going to send it in to hopefully get repaired.
But this is where, again, I believe in life's happy accidents.
So if that mixer, my XO six, had not gone out, that 55 would still be sitting in that box.
6:31
I think what, they're $1000 or something, whatever they are, and I probably would never touch it and never learn the benefits of it.
A By posting and seeing how many people chimed in were, you know, they 100% believe that's the better mixer for everything they're doing from PVA and Glass.
6:52
And so that's number one.
And then two, you know, maybe this is bad at me, but I'm looking forward to learning a new way of holding the mixer and seeing how it mixes, you know, my batches and tempers and do it does all that kind of stuff.
7:08
So I'm still going to send the other one and just get repaired and then I'll leave it as a backup.
Yeah, because I also have the the even stock one too.
I think it's the bigger one, the 20 through R, but it's got a, you know, only goes to a 500 RPMI don't like those.
7:25
They have the the little knob.
You have to turn it up and down right?
It's not a variable speed trigger, correct?
Yeah, I just leave it on full speed.
I know, I think sucks though.
Yeah.
It sucks.
I've got.
Delay to it.
It's definitely a different animal.
They they have some cool tools.
Don't get me wrong, I do like some of their things.
7:41
I I used to see them at World of Concrete every year and I think they have some really neat stuff.
But that mixer is such a pain to use with a little variable speed, you know it's just.
And it never really gets to a good speed.
No, they had one.
8:00
And I think because I like literally I was just looking at this, I was looking at oh shoot, who's the guy up in I think Oregon Concrete Expressions.
So he still had the 20 anyway, the very the the two switch.
8:16
So it has the higher RPM and I'm like, say again, this is where my head's at, right?
I'm like, maybe I'm just going to go ahead and get that one.
Even though I have this 55, I know where my comfort zone I've been using a single paddle for so long, I'm just not going to do it.
I'm going to just get another one.
8:33
But then just the way I look at things, I went actually to the CS Unitech and that mixer is no longer on their website.
So then I'm like oh crap I'm not buying that thing.
If they discontinued it you know, like not cool man.
8:48
I'll just send in the O 6 and see if they can put a new trigger on it and and but I'm really I'm excited to see what this dual pattern mixer is.
You know, I I really am.
Especially like I said post so many people posting positive stuff about it it it it eased my fear I guess.
9:10
Yeah, you know what it is?
It's a mixer with two paddles.
There you go.
You want to know what the Dual Palette Paddle Mixer.
Is it's got it's dual?
It's got dual 2 paddles instead of 1.
9:27
That's right.
That's right.
Yeah.
So yeah, I'm still single.
Looked at the price of them, those, those XO six, I think when I bought this one, kind of like you.
I think they're like, you know, 400 or 500 bucks and now they're like $800.
9:42
Yeah, it's crazy.
Everything is crazy.
All the prices are crazy right now.
It's just it's blowing my mind.
But the benefit of a single blade, for me, the benefit is it has a ring on the blade and you can't chew up a bucket.
I can go in the corners, I can dig all the stuff out, man.
9:58
Just get in there and dig all out and I'm not going to tear up the bucket at all.
With a dual blade, there is no ring because the the blades, like interlock, intersect as they spin and so they can't have a blade on the bottom or a ring on the bottom.
There's two because.
There's two blades.
Dose for our bilingual speakers dose blades porfivor.
10:19
Because of that there isn't that safety ring.
And So what people are saying is, you know they still hit the sides of the bucket at the bottom and they don't really chew it up unless they really spend a lot of time doing it.
But that is the danger is when you're going along, if there's no safety ring you're hitting it, you can start putting chips in.
10:35
And that happened to me back when I used that mixer was we did get chips of plastic in our mix whether it was we're using the black buckets and we got the black pieces or if I'm using a Home Depot bucket I get a little orange pieces of plastic.
That did happen to me.
Now again, I'm an idiot.
10:52
I don't put it past me to be complete dummy when it comes to this stuff and that's probably not using it correctly and that's probably just too heavy-handed.
And there's obviously people are having a much better outcome using that mixer than I did.
So by all means, I'm like, you know, I'm glad to hear people are having great success with it and I think you should give it a shot.
11:12
I'm going to stick with the single blade because that's my safety zone.
I had that one horrible experience, which in my life was the most embarrassing moment of my life, bar none.
I can't think of anything else that was more embarrassing than that moment.
And because of that, I've been scarred for life.
And it's just, you know, it's like I hear the choppers when I have, like, flashbacks, you know, I wake up screaming and I'm covered in sweat.
11:37
My wife's like, what's wrong?
What's wrong?
I'm like the dual blade mixer.
It broke, you know?
It's just a dream, honey.
But it's not.
It's not what are they called.
PTMD Post Traumatic Mixing Disorder.
Yes, yes, yes.
11:53
So anyways.
Mixer disorder.
Yeah, some of some of us never left the studio.
You know, some never left the jungle.
I never left the studio.
I'm still, you know, I still flashback to those moments.
So anyways, that's that was my experience.
But again, my experience is just that, my experience.
12:09
And yeah, I'm.
Excited, man.
We'll see what happens.
I got I don't have anything this week.
I started up on another one next week, but yeah, well, well, again, there's only one way to find out, and that's to find out.
So there might be a Dual Paddle mixer for sale, slightly used, stomped on.
12:31
Slightly used.
Speaking of things you need to sell.
I need to sell my Imer pump.
I have dude, I mean, I'm sure there's somebody out there that needs a a pump.
I'm going to pull that thing out.
I have it stored here.
I'm going to pull it out, take some photos and put it up for sale.
12:47
But if anybody's interested, it's like the mighty something, the mighty Max, mighty mighty something 30, I want to say.
Anyways, I'll pull it out, take some photos, but The thing is nearly brand new condition used like twice and I'll make you a hell of a deal on it.
13:05
So if anybody's interested, So today's podcast.
Jon.
Yes, Sir.
Do we want to talk about today's podcast?
No, it'll let you bring it on, OK.
What do you want?
To talk about.
I can talk about anything.
I know and we can.
Still, talk about dual paddle mixers.
We can talk about dual powder mixers.
13:22
I think a good conversation and doesn't be a super long conversation, but a good conversation would be what is a concrete countertop mix?
What it What makes a mix more optimal for use for countertops?
And let's talk about the basics of a concrete countertop mix.
13:39
Let's say you're a home owner and you want to just go down to Lowe's or Home Depot and get some products to cast a countertop.
What would you use and what amounts would you use?
And then we can talk about the next levels past that.
But what?
How?
How would you define a concrete countertop mix, Jon?
13:57
Wow, I don't think I could I And number one, I guess I'd have to find out what they're using it for.
You know what?
Thickness.
But the reality is I think any of us who've been doing this long enough, you can modify a SAT Crete kind of mix and with some modifications and still either precast very nicely or upright and finish very nicely just for what it and with some slight modifications, you know add a little Portland cement to it because it's pretty lean, depends how you're mixing.
14:30
And again you know like the small imer mortar man kind of thing we all know try to keep your water you know on the lower end.
And again since we're just talking about that, I don't think they carry any plasticizers at Lowe's or Home Depot.
14:45
So just keep it fairly thin.
And then from there you could actually what a lot of people do is modify with some kind of admixtures that are available would be you know bring in something like a rad mix and you know and then a little bit of plasticizers and that would work real what.
15:04
But the downside to that is all the sacrets are based around having some around pea gravels in them.
So those would be the situations where a where a person wants to cast, you know, inch and a half, maybe 2 inches thick and some kind of fiber, if you're going to add fiber that would be as beneficial as possible working around something like pea gravels, which would be smaller fibers, mostly polypropylene, things like that.
15:35
But to get to that next level.
Now, I haven't used it, but I think and again we're talking Lowe's Home Depot, I think Quikrete has something out that they're calling a countertop product, which would be more of a sand base, sand and cement.
15:51
And I think that would be all right.
The downside that I've seen with that one is it has quite a bit of plasticizer already on board.
So it's pretty limiting in what techniques you can do with it.
16:06
Mean it's to me it's mostly a precast.
It's not very effective for an upright cast only because it ends up very sticky.
Yeah, I've seen people, I've seen people post photos on different Facebook groups using that mix with varied results.
Some people have had great results and some people have had pretty bad results with that countertop mix from Quick.
16:28
Read the countertop mix.
Yeah, because I think the Plast Sizer, it just anytime it's all preloaded in and you can't control it, It's pretty easy to let it get away from it.
You put too much water in and out.
It's just, you know, soup and you're trying to pour soup, you're trying to trowel soup and it just ends up a big mess.
16:46
That's where I think people kind of kind of get in trouble.
But let's go back to because you you covered it, but you did it quickly and you didn't give specifics.
Let's go back to let's say you're a homeowner and you want to just go down.
You want to get quick Crete 5000 or Sack Crete 5000 and you want to cast a, you know, a three inch countertop at your house or A5 inch countertop for your BBQ surround for, you know, outdoor kitchen.
17:10
How would you modify that to specifically?
How would you modify that?
Well, the simplest method would just be adding some Portland cement.
Well, you say some a pound £2 per bag, I mean.
Oh no, no, no.
It would probably be 10% of the bag minimum.
So if and I don't remember what they come in, so let's let's just say it came in a, I don't know, 50 LB bag, then you'd want to add 5 lbs. 5 lbs.
17:32
Of.
Portland Cement.
Gotcha.
Because again, those mixes, they're not made to be creamy, if that makes sense, right?
So you're really, you're not adding Portland cement to make it stronger or anything, you're really just adding it to be creamy to make it easier to trowel, you know, stuff like that.
17:54
Otherwise, the reality is, I mean they're really, it's really good for post holes.
It's really good for making like a, you know, a, you know, pick up four or five, maybe 10 bags.
You know, maybe you're making a little foundation to set your air conditioner on or something like that.
18:11
You're going to broom finish it, but you're not doing anything special.
Got you.
It's just not made for that.
Yeah.
So let's say you're a homeowner, you cast your outdoor BBQ, use Quikrete 5000, you add in 10%, have Portland cement to it to to increase the quality and you're happy with the results.
18:31
But now you want to do something and you want to be better than the last one.
So what does that mean?
Well, you want it to be a denser surface.
You want to have less air holes.
You want to make it more stain resistant, acid resistant.
You know, you had a barbecue and everybody was cutting lines and now you have etch marks all over the countertop and all the little pin holes and little air holes all have debris in them now.
18:52
So the next one, you want to make it better.
How would you do that?
That would be when you bring in and.
Still using Sack Crete you're saying?
Yeah, still using Sack Crete as a base, yeah.
But at that point you'd want to bring in some puzzlings, right?
Something to help increase particle compaction and density of the mix and increase the strength and the abrasion resistance and stain resistance and all that kind of stuff.
19:12
So let's say you're using Quikrete 5000, you added 10% Portland cement.
How much RAD mix would you add to that to get a better mix?
Same, I'd go 10%. 10% so.
No question.
So if we're doing a 50 LB Bag of Quickery 5000, we would add 5 lbs of cement and then 5 lbs of RAD mix on top of that.
19:37
Correct.
Yeah.
Got you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And and the reason for that is just based on the pozzolanic profile in RAD mix.
If you went higher than that, then I could see a risking the mix, let's say curing too fast or where they refer to as self desiccation.
19:57
So meaning you may end up with little little cracks and so forth.
So 5 lbs would be more than enough.
That'll get you some puzzlons in there that'll give you some, you know, micro sands in there that really cream up your finish.
Everything that you want.
20:12
Yeah.
The only thing you can't in this case get around is, and this would be my sticking point because, you know, I'm big in fiber technologies.
Using pea gravel based mixes.
They just don't.
They don't work well with fiber technologies.
20:29
Yeah.
You know, back to the whole idea of the way fibers work.
Fibers want to lay on top of each other.
They want to create a mesh network.
They want to do all these kind of things.
And as long as there's big aggregate in there, like even the size of pea gravel, then the fiber.
Once the fiber let's say doesn't lay in a straight line, even though straight, still all those straight lines may be laying on top of each other.
20:52
Once they're no longer in a straight line, they have to bend over or bend around an aggregate.
Then the reality is, from a strength point of view that aggregates a hole, just because it's a solid hole, it doesn't change the fact that for the fiber is still considered a void.
21:12
That makes sense.
So at that point, you'd want to either make a mix and we have the mix designs on kodiakpro.com, but you want you'd want to make a mix if you want to do it yourself using sand, cement and RAD mix.
So that way you end up with a mix that doesn't have the large aggregate in it.
21:30
So when you do add a fiber technology, the fiber's doing what it needs to do, right?
Correct.
OK, Yeah.
So that would be.
So you the base level would be just using a a slightly modified off the shelf ready mix bag mix, you know quick read the next level you're.
21:47
Looking for something in the higher PSI's.
I mean, I guess what I'm saying that not the.
Not the 3000, not the 3000.
You want the 5000 PSI that you wanna add to.
Yeah, so that's that's base level.
Next level would be that plus RAD mix, right?
22:04
Yeah, next level would be.
Rad mixtures.
Yeah, next level would be a from scratch mix that you would get from Home Depot or Lowe's which would be sand cement and then rad mix.
So that would be even a better mix.
And then the next level above that would be a fully pre blended bagged mix like maker mix that has everything in it including numerous sands, cement and then all the paws lines that are in rad mix.
22:28
So then that's going to be the best possible mix.
Right.
And I, I think you said this or or to me in between that would be the person who wanted to again blend their own, you know, maybe they like their sand and they like their cement and the same thing.
22:46
I mean a basic 5050 or 6040 mix can be used, you know, like a mortar mix certainly can be used in certain situations, again with the plus or minus of shrinkage and so forth and so on.
23:01
And then from that, yeah, there your next level would be like, well, I really like what I'm using, but there's no puzzle lens.
This doesn't compact very well and I'm not familiar with plasticizers maybe.
So that's where you'd bring in some kind of a good admixture.
And then from there, yeah, the the, let's say the ultimate in ease would be, yeah, just have it pre blended.
23:24
Well, if you're using RAD Mix, the mix design we have on our on our website is 17 lbs of Portland cement, a little over 14 lbs of 35 minus mesh sands, 9.7 lbs of 60 mesh and then 9.1 lbs of RAD mix.
23:43
That's the £50 mix recipe and you can scale that up or down, but that's the mix we have on the website.
Well, I want to add something.
I've actually gotten questions about this before like you know and I don't think they were ever done negatively, but like someone's like well you know, I don't, I don't want to use two Sans.
24:01
You know, can I just and the the answer is like well you can just just realize that that mix recipe plus or minus is set to design A mix again based around a, you know, PSI profile.
24:18
So about 17 to 19,000 PSI.
And so there it takes a few more sands to integrate to get good compaction.
But a person can certainly use a 30 mesh sand.
And then with that, again talk to us, it's just it's going to be a little less water demand and so forth and so on, but it certainly can be done.
24:38
Yeah, you just won't have as dense of a mix.
Correct.
You just won't have the same dense as the mix.
But as I keep saying, I I think I read AI Forget, it was on a forum page where somebody was under the impression that again they were using a truck mix and they went by like a 40 MPA, which I think that's like again A5000PSI mix or something.
25:03
And then somebody told them that, you know, based on that strength that it wouldn't be a good product.
And I guess where I'm going with it is, per what I'm describing is even with five, even with 2000 PSI, you know, a cup's not going to fall through it, right.
I mean that's the you can still stand on it, you can still do all these kind of things.
25:23
So by not having a better sand profile, just because it may not be as strong and it may not be as dense, it'll still work very effectively for what you're trying to, let's say, depending on what you're trying to accomplish.
25:39
That's all.
People get lost in the weeds when it comes to strength and they think more is better because I want a stronger concrete and for the most part it's so over engineered for what we're doing anyways.
Correct.
25:57
Is it on my side or your side?
You hear that?
Yeah, sounds like a little wheezing or something.
I think it's a plane, but if it's a plane, I never hear a plane coming that low over my place anyways.
So when it comes to strength, density is what we're striving for.
26:15
We're we're striving for the densest concrete possible because that's going to make it as stain resistant as possible and that's really what we want.
And you know, if anybody's known, Jon, for the last 20 years, you know that his philosophy has always been, let's start with the concrete, let's not rely on the sealer to make the concrete durable.
26:34
Let's start with the concrete, make concrete as durable as possible.
And the sealer is just secondary to the concrete itself.
And so the, the way we get strength is through particle compaction.
So we're we're gradating particle size to get an extremely, extremely dense mix and that's done through sands and that's done through the cement, it's done through the pozzilence.
26:53
So when we get these super dense mixes, you know, kind of a byproduct of that is incredibly high strengths.
But that wasn't the goal because we don't care about 19,000 PSI or 22,000 or 25,000.
None of that matters to us.
But what does matter to us is that we have an incredibly durable surface and the strengths are just a a happy, you know, byproduct of incredible densities well.
27:19
I was actually laughing about this one day.
I got a good conversation with, I don't know I guess it was a month or so ago and I was talking to something similar with an individual and it wasn't a bad conversation.
You were just talking about sealers and and this kind of stuff.
27:35
And I'm like, well, and then he just asked me point blank.
He's like Jon, I mean your approach about the concrete.
I really like it.
He goes, but in some ways it just doesn't under.
I don't get it.
I go, well, let me give you an example.
My truck, what's the benefits of the truck?
27:53
And you know, we talked about the Cummins motor and blah.
Like I said, OK, so when the designers of that were putting this truck together, you know, the suspension, the motor, the transmission, or did they go like, hey, everything's dependent on the paint, you know, the paint.
28:12
And, you know, that's, that's the real critical thing here.
And it's the paint that really makes this whole truck durable.
Yeah.
If we had that kind of conversation in that situation, we'd all be like, oh, that's that sounds silly.
You know, that doesn't, that doesn't sound right.
28:29
I mean, it sounds so comical.
Even putting those words out there makes it sound ridiculous for even having that thought process.
So I guess that's where I just like the same thing.
I've tried to look at concrete this material from a raw material point of view and say at at what alterations what where can we push these chemistries And the ability which in my opinion it's infinite and continues to get you know further and further towards Infinity every day as this industry in an effort to tackle problems like like what just happened with COVID and raw material supplies and the difference in puzzle ONS and what's available.
29:16
And I think we had this conversation about you know fly ash today doesn't have the puzzle onic effect before because again based on carbon dioxide and how they how the the foundries work they're moving electric.
And anyway, so a lot of we're creating our own problems and trying to find solutions at the same time.
29:35
And as we're finding these solutions, the solution keeps pointing to higher and higher higher durability in the concrete.
And it's pretty amazing.
Yeah.
In my opinion, it's pretty amazing to see where this chemistry continues to head towards not sealing technologies.
29:54
And see, there's the thing.
So sealing Technologies have pretty much topped out.
I mean, you know what I mean?
Or maybe you don't.
I'm just saying you know urethanes are urethanes and you know obviously BASF and Evonik and SMP and stall polymers and you know they're always trying to do some interesting things.
30:13
But the reality is you know aliphatics and so forth you're you're you're kind of topped out in in those abilities.
Acrylics are pretty topped out.
Silicate chemistries is really the wave moving forwards and and and again right Ceramic based cameras, sio twos and now you got me on a hold and now you got to pull me out of the rabbit hole bro.
30:37
Well, yeah, I agree that all the topicals, what can be done has been done, you know, so you know what to expect of the epoxy, you know what to expect of the urethane, you know what to expect of the acrylic.
You know, what's realistic, whether don't read the label of like, oh, you know it's going to last forever because it's not.
30:54
So if you've done it for a while and you've used those products, you know what a realistic expectation is.
But what we're saying is instead of relying on that, which is what I did in the beginning, I think everybody does because that's just the natural thing, is like I'm going to rely on the sealer at some point you move away from relying on sealer to let's make a better concrete and the sealer secondary and then we can talk about sealer technologies, which we won't get on that today, but you know, topical coating, which again there's places for that.
31:21
There's definitely instances where topicals are great, but a topical coating it's it's strongest on day one and then in time it degrades and you know eventually it's going to yellow, it's going to the laminate is going to come off.
Whereas the the reactive technologies that you've really focused on are weakest on day one and they continue to gain and strength as time goes on.
31:43
So it's it's the inverse.
And I I witnessed this personally, and I've been using ICT exclusively for everything since, Probably I I'm going off memory bonus day 2010 is when I made the switch right around there 2010 and so has.
It been that long. 14 years.
32:00
My coffee table at my house.
I talk about that all the time.
But my coffee table at my house, which now is, I don't know, 8-9 years old, ten years, I don't know.
But my kids, that's their table.
That's where they sit.
And so they do everything they can to destroy that table.
Like they literally plot.
32:16
I think they plot all day long and like, what can we do to this table to destroy it?
Everything they can come up with markers, sharpies, nail Polish, paint, whatever, like it's and that table just gets hammered.
Food, orange juice.
It doesn't, it's just hammered non-stop tape, it doesn't matter.
32:37
So anyways, I clean that table every few days I go and I just you know, completely saturate it with cleaner and wipe it and it looks amazing.
It looks amazing, but that's reactive technology.
So, you know, I witnessed that on the daily, even my kitchen countertops.
32:53
You know, when I first put them in, at my house here in Wichita, when I first put them in, they were not repelling things as good as they do today.
Meaning, like if you left water on them for 1015 minutes and you you then moved that wet rag, it'd leave a dark spot, right?
33:11
But now they've been in there for a year, year and a half.
You leave a white rag on there for a day and you move it, there's nothing 0 moisture penetration you know.
So that's why we talk about reactives is they're they're weakest early on and they get stronger as they go and it's a very interesting technology that way.
33:28
The way your reactives are are the inverse curve and they're just it's a strange it's almost like the quantum field when it comes to reactives.
I had a a shop in Phoenix that faced West.
We put a concrete bench outside, actually, it's that right next to an ice cream shop as well, this bench.
33:50
So it was in front of my shop, but the ice cream shops next door.
And all day kids would come over and they'd eat ice cream, sit on the bench, they'd eat ice cream, they'd drink sodas, they'd drip hot fudge, they'd drip ice cream.
They'd spilled coke coal on it, and it would just bake and it would bake and it'd bake and I'd be at my my studio in Tempe and I wouldn't go to my shop until I got off work.
34:08
At 5-6 in the afternoon.
I'd drive over there and check on it and I'd show up and inevitably that bench was just covered and dried.
Stuff that just been baked on.
Dude, the Phoenix sun is, you know, the late afternoon sun especially.
It is incredible how hot things get.
34:25
You know, if I took a an IR thermometer, that bench is probably 140 degrees, 150° at the peak and so this stuff just got baked on.
I'd go inside, I grab a bottle of Windex and paper towels.
I come out and I'd spray it.
And when I'd spray it instantaneously, the wind decks would darken that bench like there wasn't a second.
34:43
Yeah, it.
Was raw.
Yeah, it would darken immediately.
I take a paper towel and wipe it.
Not a single stain ever, on that bench, not one stain, but the moisture from the wind decks would would go through immediately, but it never got stained.
35:00
And it's one of these things that I don't understand it.
I don't think anybody.
I don't think you even fully understand it.
You say you do.
I don't know.
If you do, it's, you know, particles when they're being observed, they they act differently than when they're not being observed.
We're talking about like, you know, quantum physics.
I think that's what's going on with the sealer.
35:16
The sealer's like at a quantum level that we don't fully understand right now.
Well, it definitely is, yeah.
It's interesting, Yeah.
Which has come a long way from 10 years ago, five years ago, and you know, the newest protect formula that's been consolidated into a single component.
35:34
Yeah, it's to me, it's now even from an early point of view, it rivals anything on the market period.
Yeah, I'm really excited about it.
I have been, but yeah, but again that's as we talk time and time again as I'm and we Kodiak ICT this, I don't know.
35:56
I guess like I think I was telling you one day or maybe it wasn't you.
It's to me this is a journey you know that's how I look at this whole thing that's been moving and continues to move is it's a journey and I'm you know, I'm thankful to be part of it.
36:13
But this journey, I don't know where it's going to end like right now right in the some of the new cure based things that I'm working on that are going to the potentials for integrating into this end of mixes which nobody's done before.
36:31
Well, I was been.
Before you got circle down that road, do we do we want to talk about that on this podcast or in a later podcast?
Well.
I don't mind if we mention it.
OK.
So before Jon starts down his thing, let me just tell you we're working on a new product.
36:47
Jon sent me some of the tests.
He's been testing it for a while.
He's like really thrilled with the results he's seeing.
We're tentatively calling it Cure Boost.
It's a liquid.
It increases the cure potential of the concrete, which has a lot of benefits and so do you want to talk about the benefits?
37:05
Yeah, the benefits continues to be any anything along the entire hydration profile.
So and this might get outside when you call it pozzolanic effect nucleization.
I mean I can get all kinds of fancy words whatever we want to come up with.
37:21
But in these style mixes the particles are so small.
I mean in fact some are calling something as simple as a non chloride accelerator, but that's not really true because it's not necessarily speeding up your set time.
37:36
What it's doing is it goes in there and modifies and evens out.
And this is what I'm seeing.
And through all the testing I've been using the Thermo temp, the sensor push tensor, all this stuff, you know to really monitor how the cure is happening and how that hydration spike is happening.
37:57
And it's very interesting to see that now instead of seeing really sharp spikes, you're seeing more of this Dome shape happening.
So what's really what's going on is it's controlling evaporation better than let's say other additives.
38:15
Because now it's when you take something this small and go in, you're getting an instantaneous effect that happens from the moment it's brought on board to a control.
Any evaporation instantly cause posilonic effects which then instantly increase the boost in your plasticizing technology and in which again from a cement particle we call that nucleization.
38:46
And and then with that, that's why I try not to go too hard in the posilonic effect because a lot of people understand posilons as the idea of converting waste product meaning calcium hydroxide into CSH.
And yes that's true.
39:02
And yes this will these kind of things go and they do it instantaneous where even silica fumes or the rest of them, right V cast, you know it happens at 7:00, maybe 14 to 2030 days.
This happens instantly the moment it's brought on board.
39:20
And so with that then I think in the past I used to talk about cement particle like an onion, right?
Or maybe that was Shrek.
No, that's you.
Yeah.
Dude, I I've told, I've told your analogy, did so many workshops about how you talk about an onion.
You peel back the layers.
39:36
Yeah.
Right.
And yeah, So what the same idea.
If if that onion is left as an onion, and we call that a cement particle, then you know crystals can only grow based on the size of that onion and the length of the of the crystals that come off that onion.
39:53
But one way or none of that, that particle ends up packing based on the size and shape of the onion.
But if we can take that onion and in this case chemically which they call nucleation, break that onion down into 1000 little onions which then goes in and you know, increases total density, strength, hydration.
40:17
It takes everything to a new level further than where we're at.
So once again you get richness of you know even further richness of color you know increased total quality of your mix.
You know you know anyway I could go on and on but it's it's really exciting to see the I mean this is something this is this is whole idea has been around for a while quite some time actually and the problem has always been control meaning some of the earliest ways people were trying to adopt this into cement based products was oh hey look you just put it in but what happened is it it basically I mean as an example they took a nine yard mixing truck.
41:07
You load it into the truck thinking hey this is going to be better and next thing you know the truck's falling over on its sides because 9 yards of concrete almost instantly hardened.
So it's so funny.
So so basically kind of like what you were saying with the double paddle mixer the whole industry walked away.
41:25
They just walked away from it like Nope it's not viable it's not going to work.
OK.
So, but basically over the last probably five years as and this is again innovation, as innovation continues, there's been advancements in plasticizing technologies, There's been advancements that now I'm just going to say when those were trying to be introduced, they were just ahead of their time.
41:52
And so now there are lots of research being dumped into this to see the benefits because the benefits have to do with again increasing the efficiency of cement again, carbon footprints, you know, all this kind of stuff is driving this innovation.
42:14
And with that I'm, I'm humbled and have been humbled to be a part of it.
So I'm very excited on small scale been introducing this to to people just including yourself, right.
I think you got a gallon coming tomorrow and yeah man, this is going to be the next wave, the next wave in this journey.
42:35
Well, for me.
See how much further we can push this.
Yeah.
For me, what's interesting about it is Steve Millard, you know, I I've talked about on the last couple podcasts that I'm 3D printing molds for concrete, which is a lot of fun.
And I'm, I'm having a good time with that.
But I'm using PLA plastic filament and Steve Millard made a comment like, oh, you don't want to use PLA because the concrete gets too hot when it exotherms and it can deform your mold.
43:03
And I looked up PLA and it the deformation is between 140 and 150°, which if your concrete's curing in 150, it's pretty hot.
That's right, yeah, that's pretty hot.
But something that you told me because you've been tracking this with with the cure monitors you have is that the the interesting thing is it's not exotherm and is high, it's accident at a lower level for a longer period, but at a lower level.
43:31
And so that for me is really interesting because I am excited about this, you know the possibilities of 3D printers and concrete, but the exotherm is an issue if you're using PLA, but this solves that problem.
So I think that's an interesting benefit as well.
43:47
Well, there's so much benefit to that.
You know the, the benefits again, when we look out out there and see on the market and see you know what, what are the things that it doesn't matter what admixture we're talking.
44:02
And I don't mean by name, I just mean by raw material and the reason for using it, you know a lot of the ones that we've used historically we're again, let's say to try to prevent moisture loss, right.
And there's lots of ways to skin that cat, but essentially that's the cat we've been trying to skin.
44:22
And the reason we're trying to skin that cat has been just that the hotter the concrete goes.
And I think I've told this story many times with Buddy Rhodes ECC, right.
So the ECC mixes get pretty warm and there was one time we were at Epic where everybody was so excited to demould something and they and it was a huge piece, man.
44:46
And they started pulling the sides and everybody popped their heads over and just steam burnt their faces.
I mean, it looked like they had been, you know, sunburned really badly and it was crazy.
But that was a mix that easily could see, you know, 140 to even 175°F in the actual spike.
45:09
But it was designed around that.
And and ultimately what that means is, yeah, you there is a potential for, you know, vapor, hence steam to leave the system.
And when that happens and that's not going to hydration it, you know what?
Again, what referred to as self desiccation.
45:24
But in this case, yeah, it was just amazing to see by loading it, even at higher rates, that exothermic spike continue to come down, come down and come down by as much as 20°F.
Which again tells you that a complete optimization in total hydration, because as long as that temperature is lower, there's less potential for the vapor to lease the system in the first place.
45:51
Gotcha.
That's interesting.
Yeah.
Well, I'm looking forward to trying it.
I'm excited about it.
I received a few texts we always talked about on every podcast, kind of the text we've been receiving, our messages we're receiving.
And I received a text from somebody that's making the switch from Buddy Rhodes ECC, which is funny.
46:06
You just brought up the ECC mix, but they're making the switch from Buddy Rhodes ECC to Maker Mix.
And he just asked how's this compare cost wise?
And so I said, well, we'll talk about next podcast.
So you know, we've done this before in the past, but it's been a while.
46:22
So I pulled up most recent numbers of Buddy Rhodes products and the most recent numbers for Kodiak Pro products and we'll just do a side by side comparison.
We're not talking about which is better.
None of that matters.
We're just talking about price.
What's the price, right?
And so I looked at the Buddy Rhodes website and we'll just talk about pallet pricing because that's going to be the most apples to apples.
46:41
So Buddy Rhodes ECC mix, a pallet price is $44.26 a bag.
That's what it currently is on their website.
Kodiak Pro is $45.00 a bag.
So what is that $0.74 more a bag?
Retail price.
46:57
But if you're a pro level then it's $40.40 dollars a bag and most of our customers at this point have reached Pro status.
Pro status is just once you've spent $8000 in a 12 month period, you get bumped to Pro status which is an 11% discount and so.
47:13
But most of our customers have reached that level.
So that's $40 a bag.
So Buddy, Rd.
ZCC 4426 Maker Mix 40 and then a better way to look at that beyond just the price per bag is what's the price per square foot.
That's where it really matters.
47:29
So Buddy Rhodes ECC is $8.85 a square foot and Kodiak Pro Maker Mix is $8 a square foot.
So it's you know, $0.85 less a square foot.
That's a pro pricing.
And if we look at just retail price, it's $9 a square foot, so it's $0.15 more a square foot at retail pricing there it is.
47:51
So let's say you're doing a 60 square foot kitchen, which I think an average kitchen is probably around 60 square feet if you.
I'm just doing this math in my head.
But if you buy it at retail, you're gonna spend $9 more to use maker mix.
48:07
And if you let me, let me do my calculator here, 60 * .85 and if you have pro pricing, you're gonna save $51.
So there there's the breakdown.
Does that make or break anybody does $9 savings or or or $9 more or 51 dollars savings, you know, depending on if you're pro or not, Does that make a difference?
48:29
I I would say for most people it doesn't.
No.
But there's the numbers.
There's the numbers.
Just cut and dry.
That's what it is.
Any input?
No, I mean, if that's what we're just comparing raw materials and per bag price, there you go.
Yeah.
I mean, it's not an apples to apples comparison.
48:45
I think anybody that's used ECC and is used maker mix there, there's dramatic differences in the mix.
So don't confuse the price comparison with comparing apples to apples.
It's like saying the cost of this orange and the cost of the apple, let's compare those.
That's really what we're doing.
49:01
That being said, because there are no other comparable products to maker mix and the reason is maker mix is a truly innovative product.
So it's not a, it's not a derivative, it's not, you know, so many of the mixes on the market are essentially the same.
They might just have a slightly different ratio of this or a slightly different whatever different polymer in it or whatever it is, but they're all essentially the same.
49:21
And so those those comparisons are much more apples, apples, but there is no equivalent to maker mix.
But that being said, like this person to text me that's what they've been using and now they're making a switch and they want to know, you know, how's it, how's it compare cost wise.
49:38
So that's all we're comparing.
It's just cost.
Next thing I want to hit real quick Jon is the workshop.
So again, we've had, I don't know, three or four people sign up for the Hero's Quest this last week, which is awesome.
I think we're past the halfway point at this point.
We cap it at 30.
49:54
So the concrete Hero's quest is May 1st through 3rd and Napa CA Joe Bates shop.
This is going to be an advanced mold making workshop and a Ramcrete workshop and Ramcrete I've really talked about a lot in the last few podcasts as far as the Hero's Quest.
But Ramcrete again text and messages.
50:12
All week I've been getting tons of messages from people asking about Ramcrete.
So it's either people that are have attended a hero's quest that are doing it, that are wanting to get advice, they have a project coming up and are wanting to talk about it.
Or it's people that are wanting to do it that are saying hey, you know what's the mix, what's the process And we cover all that in the Hero's Quest workshop.
50:31
So if you're that was.
Fun.
I was just thinking sorry as I'm listening to Interrupting Hero's Quest because the same I get questions about Ramcrete and I'm going to digress back to just again cost comparison which is perfect.
50:47
But it'd be I think we it'd be nice for us to do a better job maybe on our Instagram or something posting the photos and the kind of stuff that people are doing with Ramcrete like Kyle Davis, you know I mean he's done some pretty neat stuff.
51:07
James McRae who just did some panels in Ram Creek And then I was thinking of Phil Courtney who just remember the the video he just did with that big three-dimensional.
I don't know what that cast was.
I don't know if it was supposed to be a reception desk or whatever the case may be, but why in those circumstances he's choosing certain materials over other materials.
51:29
And man, what was the height of that thing?
48 inches?
Height.
There's no there's no there's no H on the end.
Height.
No.
Height.
Height.
Yeah, height.
OK.
Yeah.
And then?
It's fabulous.
51:45
It's.
Fabulous.
It's anyway you know that that's what runs through my head constantly.
And you know, we've never been to which maybe we should, you know, post more customers type of stuff.
52:02
Again, just just to highlight them, but also to show and give people an idea of what the materials continue to do without taking credit.
You know, I'm just, I don't want to be that like, oh look what we did for these guys.
And that's not what I mean.
52:18
What I mean is just, you know, look how amazing these guys are pulling off some of just incredible stuff and which they know as well as we do.
You know why they make material choices for these situations.
Yeah, I agree, Jon.
Yeah.
And yeah, you're right.
52:34
I'm the one who handles social media for the most part.
And I do need to get better about posting customers projects they've made.
I share them in the stories because that's easy to do.
I can share stories, but sharing the actual post as a new post means I need to reach out to them and get them to send me the images.
52:53
And I just haven't been good about doing that.
But I do share them in stories, but that only lasts for 24 hours.
Yeah, I tried to do that with Phil's video of that again.
I'm gonna call it a reception desk.
Man.
That thing was, again, just from a casting point of view.
53:09
That thing was sweet.
Yeah, it was cool.
It's very cool.
All right, Jon, don't.
Don't mess up my float, bro.
I was on.
I was.
I was in it.
I was in the zone.
OK do.
I put friction in there.
You.
Put a little friction.
So don't, don't, yeah, don't do that.
So the next workshop we have, June 21st to the 23rd, fabric forming, concrete sink plus GFRC workshop that's going to be here in Wichita.
53:32
KS Goddard.
KS is the actual town.
I'm just right out right outside of Wichita, so that's going to be fun.
Class.
That's the fabric forming class I've been teaching now for I don't know how many years, close to 20.
It's been a long time.
You can learn more about that at concretedesignschool.com.
The next one's going to be August 16th through 18th, a furniture design workshop here in Kansas.
53:51
That's going to be where we go through design considerations, how you come up with a design, the criteria, and they're actually going to make our own piece of furniture.
Each person's going to make their own piece so they can take home with them again August 16th through 18th.
And then the last class we have scheduled is the Basics, the fundamental concrete workshop.
54:07
That's going to be September 28th through the 29th again here in Kansas.
If you want to learn about any of these or to register, go to concretedesignschool.com to learn more.
Anything else, Jon?
No, that's it for me, man.
Nothing else, no, no.
54:25
I mean, I'm sure I'm going to come up with something, but then we're going to end up down another rabbit hole, so.
We will.
Well, I do want to encourage people.
You know, we have that Facebook group.
Let me pull it back up real quick because there was one question.
I just want to get your opinion on it.
I haven't responded.
Let me put back up Facebook here.
54:47
Where is it?
Here we go.
OK, so if you go to Facebook again, it's concrete countertops, concrete sinks, concrete furniture and concrete tile, and you'll see a white countertop.
It's kind of like AZ shape or I guess more an S shape.
And there's these white stools that was made by Alberto Croco.
55:06
That's our our main photo for the group.
But look for that and you know, come join.
By the way, if you do send a request to join, answer the questions.
I decline anybody that doesn't answer the questions because I just feel like you're a bot that's just randomly trying to join groups to spam stuff, right?
55:22
So if you do want to join, do me a favor.
There's four questions.
Answer the questions and and and then you'll get approved.
But somebody asked a question earlier today which there hasn't been an answer yet, but they want to know.
Has anybody used either of these concrete countertop sealants?
55:40
One is Ghost Shield Countertop 880, Yep.
And the other is.
The Acryl Acryl 14 from Z form.
Yeah, I just look at it now.
I was.
Believe it or not, I just prior to you and me talking.
55:58
I'm familiar with both of them.
I don't use them, but you know, I was just going to let this person know the benefit and drawback and then let him make a decision.
What?
What are the benefits and drawbacks?
Because I don't know.
I've never used either one of them, so I have 0 experience with either one.
56:16
I'm going to say they're both, you know they're both as good as what they are.
So the go shield product, if you go look it up it's A at least it reads as a solvent based penetrating sealer.
So means it'll give probably some good oil let's call it resistance, not holdout oil resistance and water repellency kind of things.
56:37
And you know I mean that's as good as I in my if I was to just make an opinion, I put that in a nice class with maybe 511 stain proof, you know some of the other more pure penetrating base technologies.
So if that's what she's looking for that's awesome.
56:55
The Z form, again I'm going to put that in the category of you know like an acrylic, you know I'm guessing with the SI and again based on the tech data sheet.
So maybe it has a little bit of densifying technology built into it kind of idea.
57:13
And and again, I I think that's going to be OK depending on what performance a person is looking for.
So that's what is it?
And then I was just gonna add in there.
I mean, I know she's not asking, but just say, you know, this is what I'm using and these would be my reasons why.
57:33
Yeah 'cause maybe she just doesn't Acrylic.
Other choices?
Yeah, acrylics aren't bad.
No there's there's certain times, like for rammed earth, acrylic is a great topical coating on top of it.
You know a lot of the sealers sold to the RAM birth industry for topicals are acrylic based.
57:49
But what are the downsides of an acrylic?
Like where?
What's the weakness of an acrylic?
Well, the only weakness is, I mean it just from what we're doing is depending on the, this goes back to the concrete you're using is acrylics are based on continued maintenance, that's all.
58:06
And I don't think that's a bad thing.
It's just it is what it is.
They're going to wear, they're made, they they're going to need to be reapplied probably my guess even if a well used kitchen might be once a year to every other year kind of idea, I mean that that would be fair and if if that's OK, then you know, that's OK for me.
58:30
Yeah, but as far as topical goes, acrylics are breathable.
Which is good.
Yeah, yeah.
So that's a good.
Thing.
But in this case and again just with in this case, if we're back to that like oh, but I set something on and I just don't want it to darken.
Well no, then you know that that particular product would just not fit the bill that you were looking for.
58:53
That's all.
But you know, but if you spill some oil or whatever and wiped it up and you were you know a semi clean person, then yeah, I see no issues with that at all.
I don't.
Want to speak for you, but for me, if I was going to use a topical, I'd prefer to use a topical that is breathable.
Yeah, because it's the inability for the coding to out gas moisture that really becomes problematic for a lot of the topical technologies is if they're, if they're impervious and moisture built up underneath that plastic coating, that's when delamination becomes much more problematic.
59:30
So if it has ability.
On the forum.
I don't know if it was this forum, but the same thing someone posted a picture of a project where it looks like over time there was like.
I hate to call it Whiting, but that's what it was.
59:48
So whoever sealed it used more of an A non breathable film based technology.
And over time I didn't even say.
I think they even did say they used an admixture product with polymers in it.
So in time what happened is most likely it wasn't sealed from underneath and you know moisture, vapor, concrete, breeze.
1:00:11
It's the nature of the beast, and though that breathability is.
Coming up under the film and so you know you're going to end up with this kind of like ghosting kind of situation that happens up under the film.
The film may still be intact, but you'll start seeing this almost what what appears to be bleaching out or Whiting out of the concrete and really what that is, is the moisture.
1:00:36
You know, trying to breathe in a non breathable or not breathable enough situation.
Back in the day when I used to use EAP, I did a bar in Tempe, AZ called Cornish Pasty Company and the owner had laser cut steel letters, just mild steel that said Cornish Pasty Company that he wanted me to inlay into the countertops.
1:00:59
And I, you know, I told him I'm not a big fan of doing that because the concrete and the steel are going to expand and contract at different rates and you're going to get a little spider cracks.
He's like, I don't care, you know, I don't, I don't care about that.
OK, whatever.
So I did it and we sealed it with the AP.
It looked really great.
1:01:16
I mean, it looked great for years after.
There's, I think there's a picture of my website.
If you go to hard-goods.com and you Scroll down the countertops, it'll cycle through, you'll see it.
But it's like black countertop and says Cornish pasty.
And there's a bunch of people sitting there in the photo.
But what happened was over the years, you know, there's that that topical coating, that film coating, there's moisture built up underneath the coating between the steel in a spider rusted the steel underneath the coating.
1:01:44
Well, you could see it was just like a spider web of rust just everywhere on the steel, but it was underneath the plastic coating.
So yeah, I mean that's moisture gets caught underneath and it can't get through and that's the downside of it.
1:02:00
But so this product, the Z Systems Cy Acryl 14, it's an acrylic, so you're not going to have that issue of it not letting moisture vapor pass through, which is good.
Which is good, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
1:02:16
Absolutely.
So yeah, I was just, I was just sitting down to, I mean, maybe it was helpful for her.
Just give her some information to point in a direction.
That's all.
Yeah, But if you want to be a part of these conversations, go to Facebook and join that group.
We'd love to see you there.
Yeah.
OK, Jon, anything else?
1:02:35
That's it.
That it?
That's it for today.
Yes, Sir.
OK.
All right.
Well, until next week, Jon.
All right, buddy, Good talking to you.
Adios.
Adios, I'm going to go try my dual paddle mixer.
Dual means dose 2.
1:02:53
Right on man, Talk to you later.
#ConcreteCrafting #DIYCountertops #HardwareStoreMix #CreativeConcrete #HandmadeHome #CraftyCreators #ConcreteArtistry #DIYHomeProjects #CountertopCreations #MixingMagic